Summary of what the new infrastructure code fork is about

dbk - perfectly understandable from the red-blooded hound dog that you are.:slight_smile:

Laverda - :joy:British humor is generally a couple clicks more cerebral and sophisticated than American sight gags, though this bloke had quite the knack for it -

I am STUNNED by this post. This is an admission by Waytools that feature creep suggested by TREG that has indefinitely delayed General Release.

I read this that if they had not done TREG they would have done General Release 2 or 3 years ago.

I believe Waytools is an extremely innovative company that has a huge short coming. A complete inability to estimate the length of time projects will take them. Waytools then makes decisions based on very faulty information.

On Feb 17th I stated that the new Code Fork would not be released to TREG until this summer at the earliest. And General Release won’t happen until after 2020.

I still believe my date estimates are better than Waytools. I would hope that when they decided to do the new Code Fork that they would not have decided to do the Code Fork if, as i predict, it adds 2 years to General Release.


New firmware infrastructure code fork is limited to feature parity with current release that users have now.

Changes and additions during TREG were prompted by users, who lobbied for them as reasonable and desirable for popular use cases.

Lots of other elaborate features were also requested and put on the wishlist, but we deferred those until after general release to manage scope.

The judgment to bin these requests into the right categories was nontrivial. There can be many viewpoints as to where to draw the line. But we think current users have helped us validate that the current feature set was reasonable for the first general release.

The essence of TREG was to establish what users truly needed in hardcore daily, real-life usage. The process actually worked amazingly well.

Sorting and refining to achieve the current high functionality was the purpose of this phase, and it was effective. The result is something no other company has achieved.


Getting a little anxious about the silence on the forums. Was hoping for an update quite some time ago. Don’t feel any more confident about general release than I did this time last year. Or the year before. Or the year before that. Or…


Their silence can mean 2 completely different things:

  1. There is a lot of work undergoing and they are flooded with the final documentation and inventory update for the new firmware fork release.
  2. A new major issue was discovered/reported and they are busy with the RCA.

Both of them let us in a foggy environment, due to all miscommunication that happened before and keep happening the normative behavior is to be very careful with our expectations or very aggressive with our disappointments, again no good for both sides.

@waytools can you guys bright up the situation? A couple weeks ago a new post was expected and nothing at all so far.

Vinicabrera - primarily category 1 - just a lot of migration tasks to check off, to establish feature parity. Majority are already operational now, but still a list of details to work through.

Not any category 2 - No new science projects have arisen, nor any fundamental conflicts as a result of the firmware infrastructure advances.

Just steadily working through it, and we do each validation as we complete each section. That stepwise process is quite important to assure we’re on solid footing. We confirm good performance of each part, so we avoid causing unexpected interactions with overall integration, so progress is reliable and efficient. You don’t want to have to backtrack and iterate, so it’s important to do the unit and integration tests right after each migration step.

Because we do that testing along the way, we also get good data about performance advances. That’s how we know jumps are now about 2X faster for example.

To date, it has worked out that each new section we complete has been outperforming its predecessor, while also being more optimally organized and simpler to maintain, so we are very encouraged with the results.


So, my question is how many sections have been completed and how many are left to do? That would give us a progress bar to how things are going (yes, I know each section takes different amounts of time, just like the progress bar when installing something doesn’t advance monotonically, but it gives a sense of how things are going.) And if it was updated regularly, it would be even more helpful.



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Monotonically is my new favourite word.


Well, we are down to the last 2 weeks of May. Would be nice not to be worrying about the update until the last minute! Especially since sometimes the last minute ends up being not at all.


Sometimes? It’s been like that for the past 8 months.


I know. But since it hasn’t ALWAYS been that way, I said “sometimes”.

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Been reviewing and taking notes of hundreds of posts and came across this thread which, going back to the first post by WT provides a pretty good summary of why they are doing the rewrite. I’m sure not everyone will agree with the decision, but I’ve seen people say WT hasn’t said why they are doing it this way so a reminder is in order.

Their posts in this thread are not the only ones I’ve come across about this decision, but it is the most complete I’ve found in one place. There are only 10 WT posts and a good portion of them can be quickly identified as NOT being about why they are doing the new firmware so they can be quickly skipped.

When you take these 2 lines from WayTools’ post (May 1), what do you think the chances are of expanding TREG users?

“Lots of other elaborate features were also requested and put on the wishlist, but we deferred those until after general release to manage scope.”
“The essence of TREG was to establish what users truly needed in hardcore daily, real-life usage. The process actually worked amazingly well.”

It sounds more like, “Once we complete the latest changes and test it, we will go to General Release.” Or, am I reading too much into it?

I would like to see all contributors who have volunteered to be a TREG member be given a TextBlade earlier than the General Release (as a reward, of course).