Paying Customers Shouldn't Have To Seek Updates

Thanks, you agree you can use it on Android. That was my point. If you have further complaints, can you make them in a temperate tone, as a currently non but potentially future customer? It’s perfectly possible to make a trenchant argument in a civil manner.

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@orand Compliance with the Merchant Agreement from the Credit Card Companies & compliance with the FTC Rules regarding Billed for Merchandise Never Received (https://www.consumer.ftc.gov/articles/0221-billed-merchandise-you-never-received#rights).

I listed a few of their knowingly deceptive practices (ship dates still being suggested on the Availability page) and using an Order button instead of a calling it a Pre-Order.

Also, they should stop charging credit cards immediately and instead use a priority order system similar to EVERY OTHER company that does pre-orders. Your place in line is reserved and your order gets charged when it ships.

As for communications, I specifically called out the order delay mechanics from the FTC rules requiring communication from the vendor to the customer when the order is going to be delayed. The burden is on the seller, not the customer which follows the original title of this thread.

These are all things WT should have been doing from the beginning. It’s time they are forced into compliance. WT has had their chance to fix these issues since they’ve been brought up repeatedly, and they actively refuse.

I sincerely doubt that WT has customer funds in an escrow account, but that would need to be investigated by the FBI for potential wire & mail fraud for misuse of funds. I haven’t gone to that avenue yet as I figured I’d let the consumer protection agencies allow WT to show good faith before taking the step to willful fraud.

Ignorance is not an excuse. They must still be in compliance. It’s the basics of business.

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I’m told that. Obviously not with full function, nor can firmware updates be applied. It’s so crippled that only iOS users can be accepted into TREG. MultiMap is part of the offer, apparently development hasn’t even been started, and there’s utterly no mention of that on the offer. The same offer that estimates deliveries will begin “this month”.

You mind your own tone, and I’ll mind mine, you’re not a cruise director.

It’s really quite remarkable, the norming pressure in here used to be “don’t speak sharply or WT will cancel your order” and then “don’t speak sharply or WT will block your forum account” and then “don’t speak sharply or you’ll damage WT’s morale”.

Now it’s “Don’t speak sharply or you’ll damage the morale of the surrogates from TREG, WT isn’t even bothering to read here anymore”. We need a “world’s smallest violin” emoji. Look back over the archive; I spent plenty of time being supportive, obviously longer than I should have.

Those days are over.

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I always assumed that when I learned that they had inventory in hand for all of the current orders (pre-orders if you like) that one of those had my name on it (not literally, but you know what I mean). That means that my money was put to use to actually build my order. It is waiting finalization of testing and some hardware fixes, but they in good faith took my money and started to build it. I expected them to do this.

Analogy would be if I contracted a builder to build me a new custom house. They take the homebuyers money and start construction. The money is for labor and materials This seems normal and legal to me. And as with my dad’s house they discovered foundation problems before they completed and had to start all over. The contractor picked up the additional cost and my dad suffered a major delay in the schedule, which he willing took as he wanted it to be of sound construction.

I think that Waytools is being generous to offer me a full refund, when they have already invested in completing my order.

Just my two cents.

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Somebody needs to blow off some steam.

We’re all going to have varying levels of patience and levels of angst here. I don’t see that we gain anything by attacking each other over it.

Nobody ever said you had to have an iOS device to participate in TREG, you assumed that. For all we know, if someone without access to one were selected, WayTools may have shipped out an iPod touch along with the TextBlade.

Thanks Maggie. I’ll not look back over old posts. It was your current tone I thought objectionable and unnecessary particularly since it wasn’t targeted at Waytools but at other customers. It isn’t they who delayed your order so that you sought a refund, or who advertise android compatability without making clear some quite big differences in functionality.

I’m not sure who your last para was written for. I’ve neither said not implied any of the things you describe. In fact I’m all for trenchant argument - just well directed and civilly put.

This is incorrect. What you’re referring to is a custom order, built specifically to your specs and time & material is part of the contract. Payment schedules are agreed to based on specific milestones.

These are mass marketed, final products. Not custom orders. Unless my order comes with my name engraved on it, your analogy doesn’t apply. Think of this as an iPhone order. You don’t get charged until it ships.

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Ok, I will give you my thoughts at the reduced rate of 1.5 cents. :wink:

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Akula34 - Sorry you feel that way.

By your standard, Tesla will get called in for an inquisition. They just collected half a billion dollars in credit card preorders for the Model 3. A car that won’t ship for almost 2 years, and may experience delay.

Legal precedent for mutually voluntary, informed transactions indeed exists, and is constitutionally protected.

Your assertions of “fact” are demonstrably false, despite the authoritative tone.

Coercive attempts to “force their hand” seem more plainly an aimed at interfering with delivery to other customers who actually want the product.

Those who already have it know what’s real and true, and every person who wants theirs will get it, through the tedious but necessary work of validation to make sure they’re all happy.

Despite your (curious) refusal of a refund, given your position, we’re obliged to do so.

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So, when are you shipping?

And, isn’t the relationship between your company and this user @Akula34 sort of private, yet you publicly cancel their order? Nice. You have a dispute, but it should be up to that individual to publicly declare whether they have an order with you. Shipping @Akula34 a TextBlade is the solution.


Since you made the comparison: the difference between you and Tesla—there are many—is that they aren’t claiming their product with ship “soon.” They also have existing products and have developed customer loyalty and respect.


I added the following after WayTools closed this thread in their apparent attempt to curtail dialog:

Tesla: Charges a deposit that is roughly equal to 1.25% the final sale price. Tesla’s website explicitly refers to this as a “Reservation Deposit.”

WayTools: Charges 100% of their price up-front, plus shipping. Their “Buy” button takes you to their “Store” where you are later prompted to “Place Your Order.” Your are given an approximately two month out shipping date, no matter when you order, without regard for all previous orders remaining unfulfilled.

Tesla: Has had many delays; has also delivered products. When called out over delays, Elon Musk wagered a $1,000,000 donation to Doctors Without Borders against journalist Dan Neil’s $1000 that the TESLA Model S would ship in 2012. The journalist lost the bet and paid $1000. Musk donated the one-million-dollars anyway.

WayTools: Says its $1,000,000+ in claimed sales will be matched by giving 10,000+ free TextBlade’s to elementary school kids in need. Their website first uses the past tense to indicate “Your orders in the first 2 days helped us donate $1M in TextBlades to elementary schools” and then continues in the future tense “Grants will be awarded this summer,” with the “summer” being that of 2015. We have yet to hear how or when this obligation will be fulfilled. Presumably after general shipping begins “soon.”

Tesla, after investing many billions of dollars, has delivered products.

WayTools claims to have taken at least $1,000,000 as of January 2015, but has yet to fill a single keyboard order.

This might not sound generous, but neither is publicly cancelling a customer’s order for being rightfully critical and expecting accountability, then going on to compare yourself to Tesla when your root problem is not fulfilling sales that were paid-in-full more than one year ago.

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Here’s what I see when I follow that link:

[quote=“FTC website”]
So what do you do when you get a credit card bill but no merchandise?
Get frustrated, to be sure. But the error can be corrected. Two federal
laws — the Mail, Internet or Telephone Order Merchandise Rule and the
Fair Credit Billing Act — offer protections and procedures so you don’t
have to pay for merchandise you ordered but never got. But first things
first: Contact the seller to try to resolve the problem and get a refund. Most businesses want to keep you happy so you’ll keep coming back.[/quote]
Have you tried contacting the seller to get a refund? Unless I’m reading the website incorrectly, it sounds like that is the first course of action for someone in your situation.

I haven’t cancelled my order because I would like them to keep my money while the work to get the TB in shape to be shipped; however, it sounds like others have had no trouble getting a refund in a timely manner. If I change my mind, I’ll do what the FTC says: Contact the seller to try to resolve the problem and get a refund.

Edit: fixed a typo

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